From Chinese patriot to enemy of the state

An interview with Vicky Xu

When Vicky Xu alerted the world to the plight of the Uyghurs in March 2020, she became, alongside advocates for an independent Tibet and Taiwan, adherents of the Falun Gong, and members of the democracy movement, an official poison to the Chinese Communist Party (CCP).

China soon declared Vicky, who was living in Australia, a traitor to the nation. What followed was a ruthless campaign of transnational repression, a tactic whereby regimes surveil and harass dissenters abroad until continuing to speak out becomes intolerable. When Vicky renounced her Chinese citizenship, it only exacerbated her status as an enemy of the state.

One day, she noticed strange men lurking around her Melbourne home and photographing her at the beach—men whom Australian police later confirmed were Chinese spies. Death threats flooded her Twitter inbox and she was repeatedly caricatured in lewd cartoons. Chinese media branded her a she-demon, a drug addict, a mega-slut, and a Western pawn. She developed PTSD and receded from public life—but not for long. She had, after all, sworn allegiance to the oath of journalism: If Reporting The Truth Shall Fuck My Life, So Be It.

Recently, Vicky has shared her experience of transnational repression on Substack. I was intrigued by her introduction and the way she writes about her predicament. In one post, she claims to have taken a cosmic dose of acid without feeling a thing: "What can five tabs of LSD affect if a government can’t do shit to my precious brain?” It's a compelling theory: Can the psychological strength cultivated to defend against a superpower's attempts to break a person make them immune to the effects of psychedelic drugs? I’m inclined to entertain it.

In 2023, Vicky moved to Taiwan—double poison in the eyes of China. In June, she left. She's secretive about her current location and has pared her physical life down to a couple of suitcases. Living as a nomad drives up surveillance costs and make it easier to flee when shit hits the fan.

Just turned 30, Vicky's trying to cobble together some semblance of normal existence, training in martial arts, dating, writing a memoir, doing comedy. But what is normalcy in the crosshairs of the world's most vigilant security apparatus? She trains partly to defend against stalkers, and her every public word provokes new attacks. I’m fully aware this piece could land us both in a CCP-sponsored cartoon.

One of many cartoons Vicky has been sent on Twitter. Text: "This feels awesome."

It’s been almost five years since Vicky’s total estrangement from her former life. In that time, she’s had no contact with her family. Returning to her homeland, where she spent her first 19 years as a model patriot (she only recently covered up her ankle tattoo of China’s national flag), would all but guarantee her imprisonment. Yet she remains deeply invested in the future of the Chinese people. "In my death I no longer wish to fight the regimes," she writes, contemplating her will. "I just want to save the children."

I asked her some questions and she was kind enough to answer them.

Most people I asked were unfamiliar with transnational repression. How common are stories like yours?

It’s essentially impossible to measure how prevalent transnational repression really is. In my circle, all my friends and acquaintances know about it, and many have personally experienced it, but my circle is not a normal one by any stretch. Most everyday people have no reason to spend time thinking about transnational repression. The politically savvy would probably have read about Russia’s assassinations of dissidents and oligarchs, and news junkies may remember the Indian activist killed in Canada, or Khashoggi, who was dismembered in the Saudi embassy in Turkey. 

There are also cases of transnational repression that people know but don’t label as such—like Edward Snowden’s situation. Snowden lives a very elusive life in Russia. Why? Can we consider him a target of transnational repression?

I am both a target of transnational repression and a researcher of this phenomenon. Despite extensive study of its patterns and trends, I still couldn’t give you hard data—like how many people were repressed by a certain government in a given year. Among affected individuals I know, the vast majority have kept their heads down and their mouths shut.  

Another important point: If Country A is committing transnational repression within the borders of Country B, does Country B have a duty to protect its residents against such repression? The answer is obviously yes, yet in practice, it’s often no. And if Country B isn’t fulfilling its duty of care to residents, wouldn’t it prefer that transnational repression remain a less-discussed topic?

Important context from Freedom House: “China conducts the most sophisticated, global, and comprehensive campaign of transnational repression in the world.”

Why is maintaining a favourable global reputation so crucial for China? On one hand, it makes sense to suppress the Uyghur story. On the other, doesn’t harassing critics like you damage the country's image abroad?

I think you’re essentially asking “Why target you?” I get asked this a lot, and wrote a few paragraphs about it recently on Substack:

I think it’s because, as a person born, raised, and educated in China, I had the audacity to openly criticize Chinese policies in the public space—mainstream media articles, academic reports, television commentary, legislative processes, standup comedy. While doing this, I was also having a lot of fun (I was 21-27) and basically live-streaming my fun life on Twitter (news, comedy, fitness, amusement parks, dinners, beach, boyfriends). This rubbed Chinese nationalists and CCP loyalists in a particularly wrong way.

Then one day during some state-led nationalistic campaign, someone in the propaganda system remembered me and pushed out a manufactured news cycle that lasted months about how awful I am as a human being. I was literally called a witch by state media outlets. It’s ridiculous. I became known in the Chinese media as a massive traitor to the Han race (because I wrote about minority rights). Once that reputation was established, the paranoid security establishment tried to pursue me like a real traitor to the nation.

An analogy I like to use is that transnational repression is like a water tap—once it’s turned on, sometimes people forget to turn it off, especially if the security establishment has too fat a budget. The more ideological enemies they make out to be, the cushier their jobs become.

All I did was be in my early-mid 20s and be good at my job, which is to provide accurate analysis about China.

Coming back to your question, I believe the targeting of me has less to do with reputation management and more with enforcing ideological control through punishment. As the Chinese saying goes, 殺雞儆猴. Kill the chicken to scare the monkey. The goal is to make my life as miserable as possible, permanently, and ensure there won’t be another Vicky Xu. This approach aligns with the notion that individuals are seen as “owned” by the nation-state, expected to uphold and serve the state's values and interests, all of which is reinforced by a strong current of ethno-nationalism.

Vicky Xu first learned about the Tiananmen Square massacre while studying in Australia. Her instinct was to defend China, and in a moment of defiance, she tattooed the national flag on her ankle.

With the knowledge that you’re constantly being monitored, do you ever intentionally behave in ways to throw off or entertain your watchers?

I don’t believe I’m being constantly monitored. Twenty-four-hour surveillance is very costly and logistically challenging. It took me a while to reach this understanding, as the Chinese state clearly wants dissidents to believe we’re being monitored every step of the way.

When the severe targeting first began a few years ago, I did feel as though I was under constant watch. At the time, people’s first impression of me was that I was very “shy,” trying to make myself as small as possible. I never acted out to entertain or throw off spies. I did the opposite—constraining myself within a shell and losing the will to speak openly or share anything about myself.

These days, I no longer try to make myself invisible. I live as I please, taking necessary precautions but at peace with the idea that someone might be watching. I’ve accepted that someone may or may not be peering into my residence with binoculars, and carry on walking around naked. My need for natural light and preference for comfort outweigh any worry about being watched. I’ll even sit on the couch, fat rolls showing, picking my nose. If someone feels the need to watch or take photos, so be it. I think this is preparing me well for a career in acting, as I’m developing an incredible amount of confidence and ease in front of any gaze or scrutiny.

How do you stay sane?

Overall, my life is somewhat monastic, even dull compared to the average person. Every day, I wake up, train, and write. I pretty much eat the same thing every meal (Taiwanese braised pork rice) because I’m too lazy to look for new food. I find this monotonous routine grounding and necessary, given all the debilitating circumstances I face. (You mentioned the time when I took a ridiculous amount of acid – I’ve only done this once and probably won’t again anytime soon.)  

Every few day or months I have an “oh shit I’m fucked” moment, and then it passes. It happened again recently, and I wrote about my coping mechanism on Substack: 

What's the point of trying to think while under the influence of overwhelming, unprocessed emotions? What good decisions could I possibly make? My priority should be to expedite the impact-absorbing process through rigorous body-movements, and once my nervous system calms down, I’d be able to think and plan and strategize more efficiently. This is my life hack. So I spend entire days at the gym, punching, kicking, wrestling, throwing…

I think It’s always good to match internal and external pain, or chaos, so the body stays balanced and the mind centered. I am not encouraging self-harm, to be clear. 

A couple years ago, when I first learned how to ride a bicycle, I practiced on a busy road that was way too dangerous for beginners. Accidents were had, nothing too serious. More importantly, I was fascinated by the soothing effect of the rides to my mind. Whenever I received shocking or upsetting news (there were a lot of those that year) and couldn’t stop fixating on the worst possible outcomes, I would go for a bike ride. Before the ride, the bad news would feel like the biggest threat to my well-being. But once I was surrounded by the chaos of traffic and the immediate danger of being hit, the news wasn’t even on my mind anymore. After the ride, I would have learned that the news was at best the second most shocking thing of the day, or even the hour, and thereby gain perspective.

Now I use fights to regulate my mind. After sparring, the emotional exhaustion is often so great that I feel compelled to return to logic and logic alone.

Besides training, deep breaths can always help. Grounding techniques like naming five colors around you or counting backwards can calm the mind and body. Being a target of transnational repression really does equip one with psychological and neuroscience knowledge! 

Xu at a mixed martial arts gym in Taipei (Lee Tsung-han, RFA)

In July, you wrote, "Omg just opened WeChat for the first time in like 2 years and I’ve got zero messages. Family and friends truly moved on." Are they protecting themselves from being persecuted for treason by association? Do you hold out any hope of reconnecting with them?

I don’t know and won’t speculate on others’ thoughts or motivations.

I’ve come to terms with the fact that I may never see my family and friends in China again. I find comfort in knowing that during the years we had together, we shared so much love and laughter. No one can take that away from us. The Buddhist concept of 緣分 (yuanfen, or predestined connection) helps me accept the reality that we’re now apart. As much as we love each other, perhaps our predestined connection only extends this far, and there is no point in dwelling in sorrow over it.

You've been falsely accused of participating in mass orgies and using sex for political gain. You’ve also been portrayed in wildly degrading cartoons. Why do you think sexual attacks are a central tactic in attempts to defame you?

I’ve been asked this many times and never answered this question directly. 

Now I will: Because I’m hot and probably turn individuals in the propaganda and security departments on. I make their jobs that much more fun and they’re welcome. 

Once it was clear that returning to China was no longer an option, you doubled down on your reporting of forced labor in Xinjiang. Does having less to lose make it easier to do your work?

Absolutely. Another important factor is that all my work has been written in English, my second and more “logical” language. When I write in English, I feel almost fearless. My brain is busy with grammar and flow, and I’m less likely to censor myself or feel the inhibition that would arise when writing in Chinese. This psychological phenomenon can be explained by the concept of emotional distance in second-language processing.

This following paragraph was written by ChatGPT. I completely agree but have not fact-checked: “When we use a second language, especially in contexts requiring precision and structure, our brains often focus more on analytical tasks like syntax and word choice rather than the emotional weight of the content. Research in bilingualism suggests that when people use a second language, they’re somewhat buffered from the intense emotional responses that may accompany using their native language, partly because the second language often feels less personal or instinctive. This distance can create a sense of freedom or detachment that makes us feel bolder, especially in expressing thoughts that might otherwise be repressed by cultural or social conditioning in our native language.”

What has been the most surprising source of support or solidarity?

Gangsters in Taiwan. Before arriving in Taiwan I knew from research that they are contracted by the Chinese government to harass and target Chinese dissidents or Hong Kongers who live in Taiwan. And yet during my time in Taiwan I met many lovely gangsters who became my friends and had my back. Many of them completely disagree with my politics but they appreciate my humanity and never sold me out. 

And the most disappointing letdown or betrayal?

I’d rather not remember. 

What do you miss about living in China?

I can’t go back, so there is no point missing anything.  

Have you gained anything of value from your objectively terrible predicament?

A lot. I tweeted out a video of me writing on the lawn in a park recently, with the following comment: 

If it weren't for the years of turmoil from the Chinese Communist Party and transnational repression, I wouldn't have trained so hard or become so energetic and vibrant. My spine wouldn’t be so flexible, and my muscle mass wouldn’t have increased so quickly. 

Those who watched my media appearances a few years ago might remember that I looked quite exacerbated back then, especially when the targeting first began.

Without the Communist Party, there wouldn’t be a lovely me! 👍🥰🫶

Here’s the video: 

I’ll also share some pictures that can show you my “transformation” through this objectively terrible predicament:

From top to bottom: Shortly before the persecution started; in the midst of severe targeting; one year into severe targeting; and now

I look so much healthier, happier and lighter now. Isn’t that some miracle. 

I’ve also become a lot wiser, more resilient, and a million times tougher. While I wouldn’t say I appreciate my circumstances, I definitely appreciate myself for how well I’ve adapted and how gracefully I’ve endured. 

Your persecution is a central theme in your comedy. What’s funny about your situation?

I don’t know. There’s just something objectively funny about misery sometimes—like a person being kicked off a hill and rolling down, a toddler trying to walk but continually falling, or a dog squirming on the ground with its belly up. What’s so amusing about these moments? There’s a fine line between cruelty and humor.

I have often compared my comedy to Borat's. We both put ourselves in ludicrous situations that highlight cultural differences and misunderstandings. Like Borat, I’m always stumbling through interactions or making outrageous comments. I suppose audiences laugh out of sheer disbelief. People also tend to laugh when they find a comedian likeable, and I’d like to think I’m generally likeable.

If you could speak directly to those coordinating your persecution, what would you say to them?

I’ll love you if nobody else will. Please let me live. 

After several years of laying low, you’ve recently started publishing again and are now writing regularly on Substack. What makes it an ideal platform for the stories you want to tell?

I wasn’t exactly trying to lay low. I was contracted to write a memoir just as severe targeting began. As I mentioned, I’d lost the will to speak to other people anyway, so I stayed inside trying to write my book. It turned out that trying to write a memoir while my life was falling apart and my existence was being challenged was a terrible idea. The writing process took three years, and the manuscript was completed earlier this year—then I learned how slow and painful publishing could be.

By that point, I had settled into the role of an autobiographical writer and genuinely enjoyed the process. I started working on what could be regarded as a sequel to my memoir, You’re So Brave. However, I didn’t want to go through traditional publishing again. Briefly, I considered publishing pieces of this sequel in a magazine or something, but after all those years of working in newsrooms, I was tired of being edited and censored. I remembered my old colleague at The New York Times, Bari Weiss, and all the fun she’d been having on Substack.

After spending a weekend figuring out how to use the platform, I’ve been publishing weekly for the past two months.

What impact do you hope your work will have?

My investigative report, Uyghurs for Sale, has made a significant impact by revealing how the Chinese government transfers Uyghurs outside their homeland and subjects them to forced labor for brands like Nike, Adidas, and Apple. It has been cited in multiple legislative bills around the world, making it an achievement that's hard to surpass. I do hope to outdo my 25-year-old self at some point.

China ranks as the 7th-worst country in the world for press freedom and is the leading jailer of journalists. Do you believe this will change during your lifetime?

Nope. 

Might this conversation land me on a watchlist with the Chinese government?

Not really. Unless you continue interviewing Chinese dissidents or start doing investigative work yourself. I’d advise against traveling to mainland China. It’s not impossible that you’d be invited to a police station for tea.

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